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  • #46
    Originally posted by Similibus View Post
    Why have you chosen to only respond to this one point?
    Frankly, I'm fed up of people trying to derail the threads by throwing in information, links, other people's text etc. Go through Gina's posts and count how many times she answers my questions, ever

    Comment


    • #47
      Originally posted by Similibus View Post
      One must question the logic of using such a widely variable, poorly understood phenomenon as a control for a drug trial. It is only necessary because pharmaceutical medicines, on the whole, have such an unconvincing rate of success. By showing that they are marginally better than placebo (in relation to that particular control group) they establish that they are at least better than nothing. If all pharmaceutical medicines in clinical trials had to achieve a success rate of 75% or more, placebo controls would not be necessary.
      Placebo controls are necessary because there is a placebo effect.
      Showing that you are better than placebo, which in turn may be better than nothing, is better than showing you are better than nothing, which may not be better than placebo. Placebo is, to all intents, the standard for biochemical "nothing", because it's helping to rule out psychological effects.
      It's the best we can do, isn't it?

      Comment


      • #48
        Originally posted by Similibus View Post
        Agreed! Placebo effect relates more to subjective symptoms than objective symptoms, although there must be exceptions. Can we also agree then, that placebo effect can be ruled out when homeopathy appears to be effective in treating anything other than simple self-limiting conditions and short-term pain problems? Can placebo effect be ruled out when objective signs and symptoms resolve under homeopathic treatment?
        If the results are repeatable and under basic controls to avoid sample tainting, etc, yes. Seems fair to me.

        Comment


        • #49
          Originally posted by Gina View Post
          "Ramakrishnan" Homeopath(He is the homeopathic physician to the president of India ) that has cured thousands of cancer cases............................................. ...........His website/contact info is for the public to see,contact him yourself!Ask for details on his casework,Its you that wants this proof is it not?
          I have been unable to find anything saying he has any success that doesn't use his own book as a reference.

          This is an example of such logic:

          "I can fly. I wrote a book saying I can fly. Don't believe me? It says right here in my book!"

          Comment


          • #50
            "Ask for details on his casework"..................................As I said before.

            Moopet said:"Frankly, I'm fed up of people trying to derail the threads by throwing in information, links, other people's text etc. Go through Gina's posts and count how many times she answers my questions........................"

            Quote Moopet:
            You said:"chemo ~= 3% greater survival.
            homeo = 0% greater survival.

            Unless you claim homeopathy can cure cancer?".......................................... ............I have not derailed anything,we are still on the same subject here.You are the one that asked the question.



            To answer your questionall my other answers have jumped right over your head)
            A massive list of his "cured patient" database is most likely an option you must follow if you are truly interested in this question.

            Ask for the contact info of these patients
            Ask for Emails
            Ask for phone numbers
            Ask for hospital charts
            Ask for X-rays
            Ask for Labtests
            Ask for the allopathic diagnosis
            Ask for a full casehistory(before+after)
            I am sure out of thousands of patients many would be happy to tell you their outcome,speak to the patients themself..........................................

            How long did you spend on your Dr.Ramakrishnan Cancer research Moopet a few minutes via Google? That just is not enough to seek Your scientific thrist for information,Do you think Scientist spend a few minutes on cancer reasearch?
            "Great ideas often recieve violent opposition from mediocre minds"...................Einstein

            Comment


            • #51
              Originally posted by Gina View Post
              Ask for the contact info of these patients
              Ask for Emails
              Ask for phone numbers
              Ask for hospital charts
              Ask for X-rays
              Ask for Labtests
              Ask for the allopathic diagnosis
              Ask for a full casehistory(before+after)
              I am sure out of thousands of patients many would be happy to tell you their outcome,speak to the patients themself........................................
              No. .

              Comment


              • #52
                NO?..................

                Beautifull answer!So Ambiguously clueless...................a classic example of ignorant autointoxication
                ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
                Lets go on shall we since you asked the question:


                Here are a few cases from "Another" MD (cancer/Homeopathy)Proof

                Cancer Cases Cured With Homeopathy Treatment

                Sme of The Cancer cases Cured With Homeopathic Treatment by Eli G Jone of USA

                Case No.1. Cancer of Breast
                By: Dr B.R. Chugha
                Chief Medical Officer, Govt. Homeopathic General Hospital, India.

                The disease started a year and half before she consulted me. In narrating her history she told me that she suffered from penumonia some time back and was given a number of penicillin injection. Six months after she was cured of this pneumonia she began to feel some irritation in both the breast. At first she thought that it was only a case of ordinary itching for which she started applying some ordinary medicines on them.

                A short time later the irritation subsided giving place to a small nodule which continued to grow bigger and bigger in spite of repeated application of hot poultices, etc. It was supposed to be an ordinary boil in the beginning. She consulted an alloptahic doctor, who dignosed it as a cold tumor.

                The doctor, prescribed some medicines both for internal and external use, the internal being one of the 'Sulpha group. The result was that the so called cold tumor instead of yielding to the treatment continude to grow as ever before. Other symptoms like burning in urination and pain in the breasts also apperead.

                Further diagnosis revealed that it was a case of cancer. X-Ray treatment was given but with no effect. Penicillin injections were also tried. Ultimately it was decidedd to operate upon it. By this time the breast had become very loose and enlarged and the fibrous growth was of the size of a small orange in each breast.

                At this stage some one suggested that before operation, why not try homeopathy. This agreed upon she came to me for consultation and treatment. After a careful study of her symptoms and her history I came to the conclusion that it was a case of suppressed 'psora and sycosis and penicillin injections had added fuel to the fire. Further examination also revealed that there was pus in urine.
                I have gave 'Phytolacca IM one dose every week for 3 months. The hard mass in the breast had become slightly softer.

                The next step I gave 'Thuja 1M'. After one week or so the aggravation came on and the pateint was very restless and could get very litte sleep. The amount of pus in the urine had considerably increased and some cough also appeared. But I knew that all this was the result of my medicine.

                Burning and pain subsided after about a month and there was hardly and trace of pus in urine. All the same 'Thuja 1M' was continued for another two months. After the expiry of six months, the two malignant growths had begun to show signsn of subsiding. The were looking much smaller than before.

                For another two months I changed the medicine to Causticum. At the ednd of this period the two growths were reduced to the size of a pea-nut.
                On the ten months I gave Conium 1M and she was now practically cured.

                Case No. 2: Cancer of Left Jaw

                Some 2 yaers ago she was suffering from Pyorrhoea. The doctor and dentist advised her to get all her teeth extracted. Consequently two teeth were extracted to begin with and before more could be taken she developed pain and inflammation which did not permit of nay further extraction and could not yield to any treatment.

                After 6 moths of misery, a local hsopiatl diagnosed to be a case of cancer. She , however, resolutely refused to undergo the operation and instead came to me for consultation.

                After taken all symptoms, I gave her 'Thuja 10M, one dose for a month. After one month of waiting patiently the hardness bacme comparatively softer and inflammation also began to show signs of abating.
                This follow up by 'Hydratis' for one month and Thuja 50M for another month.
                Ther result were very satisfactory. All her symptoms including the hard lump and had practically vanished leaving only a little hardness at the seat of the extracted teeth.

                I then gave her 'Syphytum 3X bid for 22 days and that completely cureed her.
                For her Pyorrhoea which still lingered on slightly I gave her kali Carb 1M and Acid Sulp alternately everu 15th day. And that was rtthe end of all her troubles. She is now looking a picture of health.


                CASE NO.3 women 75 years old,whose habits of life had benn regular,naver had any protracted illness to use up her"reserve force" which was all needed as the sequel will show.
                she had been treated by a rectal specialist for piles.there were three tumors in the rectum about six inches above the anus.pieces of one of these tumors had been examinedby two pathologist and they pronounced it "adenoid cancer" the family physician was a graduate of heidelberg"germany ;a fine man and one of the best Greek scholars in this country.

                case no.4
                In 1906 I was consulted by DR.G.S. farquhar of Zanesville,Ohio,about his wife,who had cancer of the stomach,and i advised a plan of treatment for her as is given in this book.in this book.
                in 1907 I received a latter from him as follows "one year ago i prepared myself for such a thing as this.my wife,you will remember,presented all symptoms of cancer of the stomach and i truly thought it a mere matter of time when i should be calles upon to follow her to the grave,but thanks to you for the information given me,and to you alone, i owe my wife's existence as i am satisfied she mould have died. As it is she is nowin good health.now in 1911,five years later,she remains free from the disease.


                case no.5
                In October,1910,a gentleman from pennsylvania came under my treatment for cancer of the stomach.
                he had been sick for a year and had been examined by two old experienced physicians who have been in practice for overthirty years and there is no question about the correcttness of the diagnosis.when he first came under my treatment his nerves mewe very weak.he had diminished in weight from 215 pounds to 140 pounds. I examined his stomach and found a growth in the region of the pylorus.it was about an inch high,about two inches in diameter at the base and very sentive to the touch.He could not bear to have his hands or clothes touch this region.his pulse was the pulse of cancer weak and rapid,the tongue was broad and indented,the white of the eye had the pearly tint of cancer showwing a drain upon the system.his stomach had troubled him more or less for serverl years. at times he had a diarrhoea that lasted for some time.he had chronic nasal catarrh and spinal hyperemia as a complication.I gave him acetic acid 1st X dulution,five drops once in four hours in alternation with the acetic acid.I also gave him the double sulphide tablets (Burgess),one tablet after each meal and at bedtime.

                CASE NO.6
                in june,1876, i had a man come to me for treatment.
                his case had been diagnosed as cancer of the rectum.
                he had the morning diarrhea with burning pains in the rectum after each stool.There wes a cancerous ulcer just inside the anus.He was considerably emaciated and was anemic with no appetine.The pulse had a weak discouraged feeling.
                I gave him sulph.strychnine one-thirtieth grain before meals and at bedtime,with ferrum first decimal,three grains after each meal.I also prescribed nitric acid,fifteen drops of third decimal dilution,in half a glass of water,once in theree hours.Locally i applied oil thuja 3i.to Veseline 3X.Mix and apply the selve to the ulcer three times a day.for the diarrhea he was given tincture nuphar lutea second decimal dilution five drops once in two hours
                Cancer of Liver Cured With Homeopathy

                A lady patient age 40 years, was reffered to me having enlarge Liver and later was dignosed as Cancer of Liver.
                Patient refused operation.
                She came to me with a very good symptomatolgy Chelidonium Majus which I gave 15 days. Followed up by Lycopodium for another 15 days.

                Next I gave Cholestrinum, followed by by Beberis Vulgaris, Hydratis, Ornithogalum and lastly Carbo veg 30c.

                All the symptoms were gone especially pain in the thigh and swelling on the right foot were gone altogther. After a long treatemnt of one year, she is quite cured of her cancer.

                Cancer of Tongue
                Case reported by Prof Nik Omar
                Form Homeopathic Hospital, Kelantan.

                This was not an advanced case of cancer but approaching singsn and symptoms were quite manifest. Letf half of the tongue had turned bluish grey. Although some burning was there the tongue was cold to touch. Some inflammation was also present. Salivation was excessive. She was advised for early operation but refused (takut )

                After taking the complete case history, We have given her Hydratis 30c and followed up by 'Conium 30c' for one month.
                For another two months, we have given her Calc. Flour 6x, b.i.d
                This to be follow up again with 'Conium 200c' one dose daily for 15 days.
                Suprising after 6 months of medication, she was almost normal. Up till now she is continuing the treatment as a precautionary measure.

                Please contact the following for full case details:
                Ask for the contact info of these patients
                Ask for Emails
                Ask for phone numbers
                Ask for hospital charts
                Ask for X-rays
                Ask for Labtests
                Ask for the allopathic diagnosis
                Ask for a full casehistory(before+after)
                I am sure out of thousands of patients many would be happy to tell you their outcome,speak to the patients themself........................................sa me reply as my last post.



                Nik Omar MD
                No.122 Taman Universiti, Kg Gelang (google his name you will find his Hospital)
                "Great ideas often recieve violent opposition from mediocre minds"...................Einstein

                Comment


                • #53
                  Originally posted by Gina View Post
                  NO?..................

                  Beautifull answer!So Ambiguously clueless...................a classic example of ignorant autointoxication
                  No means no.
                  Leaving aside the issue of patient confidentiality, which this guy should respect if he even pretends to be a doctor, just, no.
                  For the same reasons I've said before.
                  Do you not understand?

                  Comment


                  • #54
                    Which is more scientific: Allopathy or Homeopathy?

                    Let us debate this interesting, essentially philosophical question.
                    These are my personal views and not necessarily my professional views.The content is for informational purposes only and should not be construed as medical advice. ALWAYS CONSULT YOUR LOCAL PHYSICIAN.

                    Comment


                    • #55
                      moopet you posted:"No means no.
                      Leaving aside the issue of patient confidentiality, which this guy should respect if he even pretends to be a doctor, just, no.
                      For the same reasons I've said before.
                      Do you not understand........................................ .................................................. .."


                      once again:
                      A massive list of his "cured patient" database is most likely an option you must follow if you are truly interested in this question.

                      See his website with some of the cured cases posted on line for anyone to read,I thought you did this already?

                      These patients fully understand their cases are on line.

                      The second step (if you truly interested in firsthand proof)
                      is to make personal contact so you can prove to yourself Homeopathy works............................
                      again you asked.

                      I am a mere conduit to pass on information to you.
                      "Great ideas often recieve violent opposition from mediocre minds"...................Einstein

                      Comment


                      • #56
                        Moopet
                        Reviews of observational studies,

                        Science and Homeopathy


                        scientific allopathy or homeopathy
                        "Great ideas often recieve violent opposition from mediocre minds"...................Einstein

                        Comment


                        • #57
                          Moopet
                          THE VALIDITY OF HOMEOPATHY
                          DOES IT WORK,

                          DATABASE OF CURED CASES
                          cure database
                          1 2 3

                          Where is the proof Conventional medicine works! or is it
                          Scientific manipulation?...........................
                          "Great ideas often recieve violent opposition from mediocre minds"...................Einstein

                          Comment


                          • #58
                            Originally posted by Gina View Post
                            NO?..................

                            Beautifull answer!So Ambiguously clueless...................a classic example of ignorant autointoxication
                            ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
                            Lets go on shall we since you asked the question:


                            Here are a few cases from "Another" MD (cancer/Homeopathy)Proof

                            Cancer Cases Cured With Homeopathy Treatment

                            Sme of The Cancer cases Cured With Homeopathic Treatment by Eli G Jone of USA

                            Case No.1. Cancer of Breast
                            By: Dr B.R. Chugha
                            Chief Medical Officer, Govt. Homeopathic General Hospital, India.

                            The disease started a year and half before she consulted me. In narrating her history she told me that she suffered from penumonia some time back and was given a number of penicillin injection. Six months after she was cured of this pneumonia she began to feel some irritation in both the breast. At first she thought that it was only a case of ordinary itching for which she started applying some ordinary medicines on them.

                            A short time later the irritation subsided giving place to a small nodule which continued to grow bigger and bigger in spite of repeated application of hot poultices, etc. It was supposed to be an ordinary boil in the beginning. She consulted an alloptahic doctor, who dignosed it as a cold tumor.

                            The doctor, prescribed some medicines both for internal and external use, the internal being one of the 'Sulpha group. The result was that the so called cold tumor instead of yielding to the treatment continude to grow as ever before. Other symptoms like burning in urination and pain in the breasts also apperead.

                            Further diagnosis revealed that it was a case of cancer. X-Ray treatment was given but with no effect. Penicillin injections were also tried. Ultimately it was decidedd to operate upon it. By this time the breast had become very loose and enlarged and the fibrous growth was of the size of a small orange in each breast.

                            At this stage some one suggested that before operation, why not try homeopathy. This agreed upon she came to me for consultation and treatment. After a careful study of her symptoms and her history I came to the conclusion that it was a case of suppressed 'psora and sycosis and penicillin injections had added fuel to the fire. Further examination also revealed that there was pus in urine.
                            I have gave 'Phytolacca IM one dose every week for 3 months. The hard mass in the breast had become slightly softer.

                            The next step I gave 'Thuja 1M'. After one week or so the aggravation came on and the pateint was very restless and could get very litte sleep. The amount of pus in the urine had considerably increased and some cough also appeared. But I knew that all this was the result of my medicine.

                            Burning and pain subsided after about a month and there was hardly and trace of pus in urine. All the same 'Thuja 1M' was continued for another two months. After the expiry of six months, the two malignant growths had begun to show signsn of subsiding. The were looking much smaller than before.

                            For another two months I changed the medicine to Causticum. At the ednd of this period the two growths were reduced to the size of a pea-nut.
                            On the ten months I gave Conium 1M and she was now practically cured.

                            Case No. 2: Cancer of Left Jaw

                            Some 2 yaers ago she was suffering from Pyorrhoea. The doctor and dentist advised her to get all her teeth extracted. Consequently two teeth were extracted to begin with and before more could be taken she developed pain and inflammation which did not permit of nay further extraction and could not yield to any treatment.

                            After 6 moths of misery, a local hsopiatl diagnosed to be a case of cancer. She , however, resolutely refused to undergo the operation and instead came to me for consultation.

                            After taken all symptoms, I gave her 'Thuja 10M, one dose for a month. After one month of waiting patiently the hardness bacme comparatively softer and inflammation also began to show signs of abating.
                            This follow up by 'Hydratis' for one month and Thuja 50M for another month.
                            Ther result were very satisfactory. All her symptoms including the hard lump and had practically vanished leaving only a little hardness at the seat of the extracted teeth.

                            I then gave her 'Syphytum 3X bid for 22 days and that completely cureed her.
                            For her Pyorrhoea which still lingered on slightly I gave her kali Carb 1M and Acid Sulp alternately everu 15th day. And that was rtthe end of all her troubles. She is now looking a picture of health.


                            CASE NO.3 women 75 years old,whose habits of life had benn regular,naver had any protracted illness to use up her"reserve force" which was all needed as the sequel will show.
                            she had been treated by a rectal specialist for piles.there were three tumors in the rectum about six inches above the anus.pieces of one of these tumors had been examinedby two pathologist and they pronounced it "adenoid cancer" the family physician was a graduate of heidelberg"germany ;a fine man and one of the best Greek scholars in this country.

                            case no.4
                            In 1906 I was consulted by DR.G.S. farquhar of Zanesville,Ohio,about his wife,who had cancer of the stomach,and i advised a plan of treatment for her as is given in this book.in this book.
                            in 1907 I received a latter from him as follows "one year ago i prepared myself for such a thing as this.my wife,you will remember,presented all symptoms of cancer of the stomach and i truly thought it a mere matter of time when i should be calles upon to follow her to the grave,but thanks to you for the information given me,and to you alone, i owe my wife's existence as i am satisfied she mould have died. As it is she is nowin good health.now in 1911,five years later,she remains free from the disease.


                            case no.5
                            In October,1910,a gentleman from pennsylvania came under my treatment for cancer of the stomach.
                            he had been sick for a year and had been examined by two old experienced physicians who have been in practice for overthirty years and there is no question about the correcttness of the diagnosis.when he first came under my treatment his nerves mewe very weak.he had diminished in weight from 215 pounds to 140 pounds. I examined his stomach and found a growth in the region of the pylorus.it was about an inch high,about two inches in diameter at the base and very sentive to the touch.He could not bear to have his hands or clothes touch this region.his pulse was the pulse of cancer weak and rapid,the tongue was broad and indented,the white of the eye had the pearly tint of cancer showwing a drain upon the system.his stomach had troubled him more or less for serverl years. at times he had a diarrhoea that lasted for some time.he had chronic nasal catarrh and spinal hyperemia as a complication.I gave him acetic acid 1st X dulution,five drops once in four hours in alternation with the acetic acid.I also gave him the double sulphide tablets (Burgess),one tablet after each meal and at bedtime.

                            CASE NO.6
                            in june,1876, i had a man come to me for treatment.
                            his case had been diagnosed as cancer of the rectum.
                            he had the morning diarrhea with burning pains in the rectum after each stool.There wes a cancerous ulcer just inside the anus.He was considerably emaciated and was anemic with no appetine.The pulse had a weak discouraged feeling.
                            I gave him sulph.strychnine one-thirtieth grain before meals and at bedtime,with ferrum first decimal,three grains after each meal.I also prescribed nitric acid,fifteen drops of third decimal dilution,in half a glass of water,once in theree hours.Locally i applied oil thuja 3i.to Veseline 3X.Mix and apply the selve to the ulcer three times a day.for the diarrhea he was given tincture nuphar lutea second decimal dilution five drops once in two hours
                            Cancer of Liver Cured With Homeopathy

                            A lady patient age 40 years, was reffered to me having enlarge Liver and later was dignosed as Cancer of Liver.
                            Patient refused operation.
                            She came to me with a very good symptomatolgy Chelidonium Majus which I gave 15 days. Followed up by Lycopodium for another 15 days.

                            Next I gave Cholestrinum, followed by by Beberis Vulgaris, Hydratis, Ornithogalum and lastly Carbo veg 30c.

                            All the symptoms were gone especially pain in the thigh and swelling on the right foot were gone altogther. After a long treatemnt of one year, she is quite cured of her cancer.

                            Cancer of Tongue
                            Case reported by Prof Nik Omar
                            Form Homeopathic Hospital, Kelantan.

                            This was not an advanced case of cancer but approaching singsn and symptoms were quite manifest. Letf half of the tongue had turned bluish grey. Although some burning was there the tongue was cold to touch. Some inflammation was also present. Salivation was excessive. She was advised for early operation but refused (takut )

                            After taking the complete case history, We have given her Hydratis 30c and followed up by 'Conium 30c' for one month.
                            For another two months, we have given her Calc. Flour 6x, b.i.d
                            This to be follow up again with 'Conium 200c' one dose daily for 15 days.
                            Suprising after 6 months of medication, she was almost normal. Up till now she is continuing the treatment as a precautionary measure.

                            Please contact the following for full case details:
                            Ask for the contact info of these patients
                            Ask for Emails
                            Ask for phone numbers
                            Ask for hospital charts
                            Ask for X-rays
                            Ask for Labtests
                            Ask for the allopathic diagnosis
                            Ask for a full casehistory(before+after)
                            I am sure out of thousands of patients many would be happy to tell you their outcome,speak to the patients themself........................................sa me reply as my last post.



                            Nik Omar MD
                            No.122 Taman Universiti, Kg Gelang (google his name you will find his Hospital)
                            Dear Gina,

                            Do you think these are true cases.i doubt it.No explanation is given of remedy selection which is necessary to convince the reader.
                            sajjad.

                            Comment


                            • #59
                              Originally posted by Gina View Post
                              The second step (if you truly interested in firsthand proof)
                              is to make personal contact so you can prove to yourself Homeopathy works............................
                              again you asked.
                              This is not how science works.

                              The title of this thread is "Which is more scientific: Allopathy or Homeopathy?"

                              You are still not contributing to this discussion.

                              Comment


                              • #60
                                Originally posted by Gina View Post
                                Moopet
                                THE VALIDITY OF HOMEOPATHY
                                DOES IT WORK,

                                DATABASE OF CURED CASES
                                cure database
                                1 2 3

                                Where is the proof Conventional medicine works! or is it
                                Scientific manipulation?...........................
                                OK, if you accept the validity of a database of cures people have submitted with nothing to back them up, you presumably also accept the validity of this:

                                What's the harm in homeopathy?

                                Thoughts?

                                And the "impossible cure" thing, well, the second top letter is claiming that the MMR vaccine caused autism. Doesn't bode well for the credibility of that site.

                                Basically, in a thread about science, stop passing off anecdotes as facts.

                                Comment

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